(Williamsport, PA) – It all started when a brewer started a ProBrewer.com thread called, “Rating the Raters: Opinions on BA & RB.”
What happened? Pennsylvania-based Bavarian Barbarian Brewing Founder, Mike Hiller, started a controversial topic and poll in which he asked fellow brewers for opinions on the two leading beer websites, Beer Advocate and RateBeer. The responses have ranged from the sites being valuable to “These seemingly alcoholic losers wouldn’t know a good beer if it was delivered by the gods themselves.” That last one comes courtesy of Yellow Belly Brewery Brewer, Liam McKenna. Oh, and there are more offensive comments than that one . . .
As for Hiller, he makes an observation about the two sites that fairly obviously applies to internet message boards in general:
“Using the whole BrewDog thing as an example, it seems to me that every criticism that could be said about them was covered in the first few posts. But it doesn’t stop there. People continued to post the same basic opinions, but with their own twist on the wording. Eventually, it becomes just a game of people trying to one-up the previous poster in wit and smart-assery. That, to me, is a brand of self-righteousness.”
[Ed. note: And yet he fails to chide some of his colleagues who are guilty of the same behavior in the thread that he started.]
It goes without saying that there are a ton of negative (and positive) comments on message boards. It’s how we often relate with one another in society . . . we complain. It’s not a BA or RB problem; it’s just how the internet society works. (And do some of these brewers stop to think that they are lumping in some of their loyal customers with these generalizations?)
That said, as I mentioned before, several brewery representatives like Greg Koch and Jeff Erway have voiced their support for the two sites and their users.
Check out the various threads here:
I think you were right the first time when you said, “it’s just how the internet works.” Most of the people who write these reviews would never say half the things to a brewer’s face that they say in the review. In some cases, they would completely change their opinion and bow down to the brewer.
Brewers are bothered by bad reviews because they never intend on brewing bad beer, but they also have to accept that palettes are varied and tastes constantly change. I don’t rely on BA or RB to tell me what I should think a good beer is – I tell myself when I’ve tasted it.
As a consumer, I find BeerAdvocate to be invaluable. I’ve saved money, found new beers, learned more about beer and beer styles, and have improved my palette just by reading the content on that site. Do I sometimes come across reviews written by people with bad attitudes? Sure, but far more often do I find the reviews to be good-natured and helpful. I don’t wander into the forums because I know, despite the fact that 90% of the posters are probably good people, that last 10% is a vocal minority of dillweeds who want to be big fish in a small pond. They’re not worth worrying about or thinking about, and making them the basis of your judgment of all BA readers and reviewers is silly and misguided.
This goes the other way around as well, I feel. You have brewers in that thread calling their own consumers alcoholics and whatnot, but you’ve also got some well-meaning criticism as well as valuable opinions from a variety of perspectives. Don’t let a few rotten apples spoil the whole bunch, I say.
I think if you are getting good press or its a good venue for free advertising you will support those sites (as a brewery owner). I am not the biggest fan of either, community attitudes being one factor, the other being (a problem on any rating site, including the likes of Yelp) of the lack of cohesion between terms and how opinions translate into ratings. Most people can’t say they think it’s a good beer, just not for them, which skews a quality rating. For any kind of successful rating process, you need to ensure that those writing ratings are all using the same vocabulary and definitions. I think these are staples of the “beer web”, but they could use some reworking.
As for message boards, they are generally horrible tools for communication and bread repetition due to poor searching ability and organizing by keyword or discussion type (e.g., question vs discussion vs rant, etc.)
At the same time, having looked into writing such types of software… its difficult and time consuming to bring these type of things to the next level with any degree of manageability.
– Eric
BeerNewb.com
What I love is how half of the BA reviews that end up C or B- or something read “This is a great beer that i’ll be drinking often!”
I do know that I’ve run into a bunch of BA type ppl at beer events, and they have a higher tendency to be the “one upper” types who go on about all their rare beers they’ve had and will plow thru 24 beer tasters in an hour
What’s the saying? Opinions are like assholes; everybody has one.
Pretty much every time I go in a cigar shop, the tobacconist tells me that the “Cigar Aficionado” ratings are BS. If you find a cigar you enjoy smoke it.
I find the same to be true of beer.
No matter what product you make people are always going to be overly critical. Don’t brew if you can’t deal with it.
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A certain amount of brewers are overly sensitive.
I know when I am considering new beers to bring into our store and add to our online store I turn to BA and RB to see what the reviews are like. If I don’t have the opportunity taste a beer before we bring it in then this is the next best thing and very valuable.
Now with that said I’ll add that I do have to call BS on a lot of the scores out there. There’s a lot of hype surrounding certain beers, especially those that are almost impossible to get while at the same time there are beers getting brutalized in the ratings unfairly.
We’ve decided to test the ratings by doing a series of blind tastings starting August 28th with 5 different Imperial IPA’s. People will have the opportunity to taste and score all 5 beers without knowing what they are. We will then total up the scores and compare them against the ratings on the two sites. We’ll announce the results the following day in our blog and on Facebook.
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